Catholic Birth Control At The Border

I’ve always admired the Catholic work done from the Mexican border and south. At least the work I know of. This was the world of Pope Francis. Now at least one priest is handing out contraception to women making the dangerous crossing from Mexico into the U. S. He does this because these women raped frequently.

When people set out determined to cross into the U. S. illegally from Mexico or the countries south of it, I’ve wondered how they know, or, why they think they will be successful. The link explains information is passed around among families. Thousands of people have gone north and sent information back. Thousands of others have not make it and there information about that.

Since criminals lurk around this activity and there is lots of money involved honest expediters can be taken over by bad people.

That is why the priest passes out birth control pills. He knows that to criminals women in route are a commodity to be bought and sold. He knows full well that his church forbids birth control use. As he says, birth control is making the best of a bad situation.

That may also be why over 90% of Catholics in the U. S. use artificial birth control even though it is banned by their church. Both Catholic women at the border and those thousands of mile away share something.

Their circumstances are different but they both desire to choose their times of pregnancy.

73 Responses

      1. Matt Noah

        See, this is where you are shown to be a hypocrite. In less than 24 hours, you stated you had no problem with Catholics being Catholics. You just didn’t want us to try to enact our beliefs in to law.

        Now, we have a case where a wayward priest is leading women astray. There is no attempt to enact a law by anyone in your story. But you have to tell Catholics that a wayward priest is a good priest. I understand that you don’t like the Catholic Church but you want to revel in a Church scandal.

        In return, I offer you an atheist scandal. Does it prove you and your fellow atheists wrong? No. No one likes a scandal. Every one of us falls short of what we profess. Try not to poke a stick in everyone’s eye daily and call it dialog or discussion.

        1. Jinx

          worm, “. You just didn’t want us to try to enact our beliefs in to law.” That is the definition of Shariah Law.

        2. Matt! Praise God for Christian folks like you. I’m grateful for folks like you who are informed with the truth, and have the courage to confidently speak for your convictions. You are an important example for we Christians who flinch when adamant atheists who know enough about Christianity to spin it with a fervour to intimidate. I admonish we Christians (including me) and step up to the plate if we are truly devout Christians, and stand for Jesus Christ. I one time I found it intimidating and uncomfortable to post comments defending Christianity, as I became more comfortable I recognized the value of using social media to witnesses for Jesus. When I finally overcame my lack of confidence and stopped agonizing about the correct usd of linguistics, I realized, how silly.. Jesus I trust in you!

      2. nemo82

        how silly. of course bad clergymen do not change the teachings of the church. anymore than one bad Republican changes the principles of the Republican party. If your view is correct then the church as an institution would have crashed and burned a long time age. consider the bad popes: there were quite a few of them. According to legend, Napoleon once said that he was going to destroy the church. the rebuttal, if we haven’t managed to destroy it ourselves, you won’t succeed either. BTW Jon, could I ask a favor: please give up this silliness and engage in some real grown up discussion of the deep issues raised (but largely ignored) on this web.

    1. Matt Noah

      humane – no. scandalous – yes.

      For all he knows, the women he gives the prescription may have reaction which would harm them. Moreover, killing children chemically by the Pill is nothing to be commended for.

      1. entech

        Did you read it?
        I was thinking as I started that even though 32 was not many I would have to be consistent and say that even 1 is too many !!!

        Half way down the page I came across the “April Fool” label and went on to see that the real story was “The Roman Catholic Diocese of Bridgeport has acknowledged in court papers that it documented 32 accusations of sexual abuse of children by priests associated with a parish here over 40 years.”

        Of course I am still disgusted this not a matter to make fun about.

        The irony is overwhelming and totally delicious, with friends like Matt the Catholic sex scandal cover up needs no enemies.

      2. I guess Jinx and entech read the story in the link and found the irony (fake story) overwhelming. To my point, Jon points out a scandal in the Church and applauds it. Just hours before he stated he is only concerned about Catholics trying to enact their beliefs in to law. Hypocrite.

        1. Thank you Matt for confirming my suspicion, I agree any message directed toward anti-Christians who visit this post only increases their resolve. Jon indicates he has a million visits. My purpose is to present another view for those who are pondering Christianity versus non-belief, hopefully they will further their inquiry with a Christianity domination of their choice. My hope they become comfortable and make an appointment with a church of their choice. We both another stand that Christian pastors have a singular purpose in their ministry. That is to provide information for those considering Christianity, no pressure, that would serve no purpose, after they become informed they have a free will to further explore Christianity. If are sceptical, they walk away, if they are motivated to reconsider, start over. We recall from Holy Scripture, Jesus said, “the first shall be last, and the last shall be first.” Through Christianity pastors are discreet and highly respectful with personal information went they minister to people. It is not infrequent that they are called to someone near death to minister to them if they want to accept Jesus as their Lord and saviour. All that is required is sincere and complete belief. Dear Jesus we know you are waiting to invite us into our heart, to radiate your perfect love, joy and peace into our hearts. Endless praise and glory to our Lord. He is always waiting, don’t hesitate to the seek the Lord when your overwhelmed and feel discouraged and experience hopelessness. Praise God!

    1. Jinx

      You are slow on the uptake worm, I haven’t read your links in a long time……..your cherry picking is so obvious and lacks credibility.

    2. Jinx

      worm, I did break my vow and read your link out of curiosity. I am ROTFLMAO!!!!! Below the little story is the real story…….its was actually an April Fools joke about athiests, but the real story is about molesting priests…….your getting sloppy in your insane rage.

  1. Jinx

    Worm, you putz, I hope you read the real story under the comment……yes there are 3 ‘articles’ on the page.

    Here is the beginning of the real story.

    Diocese Says It Recorded 32 Accusations of Abuse

    Published: November 25, 2009

    TRUMBULL, Conn. (AP) — The Roman Catholic Diocese of Bridgeport has acknowledged in court papers that it documented 32 accusations of sexual abuse of children by priests associated with a parish here over 40 years.

    The diocese made the admission last week in contesting a lawsuit filed by the estate of Michael Powel, who died last year. Mr. Powel had claimed that he was sexually abused at St. Theresa’s Parish in Trumbull between 1968, when he was 9, and 1972, when he was 13.

    The diocese is contesting a request from Mr. Powel’s lawyers to turn over all documents regarding sexual abuse by priests at the parish. In its filing in Superior Court in Waterbury, the diocese said it had compiled 126 boxes of documents and files detailing 32 accusations of abuse by eight priests at St. Theresa’s.

    1. JINX, sir, the Catholic Church was instituted by Jesus Christ when he selected Peter for its first leader. The problem is not the Catholic Church, it is a handful of Bishops and priests. That shouldn’t define 98% of the the good and decent Catholic priests as pedophiles. Studies reveal that there are currently less than 2% of all priests who are pedophiles, and as they are identified, they are turned over to law agencies for prosecution. In the past 12 months several bishops were released from their duties. Studies also reveal that up to four percent of the general population are pedophiles and like homosexuals are intrinsic to the general population. The problem not only exists In the Catholic priests, it is wide spread and also a significant problem in the general population.

      1. entech

        Ervin, no matter really but You really should say – Jinx, Madam.
        the Catholic Church was instituted by Jesus Christ when he selected Peter for its first leader.
        And you know this how? I am in no position to deny that what you believe is true, at the same time I have yet to see anyone demonstrate that it is true.

        The rest of your post is wishful thinking, the cover ups continue. Can you name a single priest you has been thrown out and left to fend for himself.
        In a previous post regarding a government enquiry in Australia:
        March 17, 2017 at 6:46 pm
        It was reported that one particular order was up to 40.4 % abusers. The overall percentage was a little over 7%
        Nice to see you acknowledge even a lesser percentage, your new friend Matt seems intent on refusing to acknowledge any possible wrongdoing – if you look carefully you will see that most of what you see as anti Catholic is actually anti Matt.
        You seem to be one of the “if you are not for us you are against us” school. It is comical that in the guise of accusing the non-Catholic universe of denigration that is what you are doing to the said universe. To you I would suggest denigration means not accepting what you consider to be truth as real and true. Is it compulsory in your world view that everyone MUST believe
        the Catholic Church was instituted by Jesus Christ when he selected Peter for its first leader. ?
        I agree that the problem is in no way restricted to the Catholic Church it is as you say “ a significant problem in the general population.” One thing that makes Matt so egregious is his constant shopping around for ways and means to shift the emphasis onto others, a form of denial which tends to make him look complicit.

        1. I appreciate Matt’s encouragement about focusing on the low hanging fruit, it’s becoming abundantly clear where he is coming from. I share this with you knowing that other eyes will read this reply, curious about what alleged far right gullible Christians, a supposed major source of fake news, are saying. You well know that as we near death, we no longer think talking about death as morbid. I find it amazingly liberating, criticism, deserve or not, mostly sails over my head. Things of this world are fleeting to me, battling with disparaging words doesn’t bother me in the least. I have a singular focus, I’m shooting for heaven, and if I miss my, goal is purgatory, to be sanctified to deserve to finally experience the perfect love, peace, joy, and goodness of God. I’m increasingly grateful to God for creating me, for the amazing opportunity to experience His miraculous creations, and now a chance to experience the unfathomable universe in all its glory, wonder and magnificent beauty. Like papa use to say it’s not the size of the dog, it’s the size of the fight in the dog that matters. Humble I say, you are a significant voice, a great warrior for Jesus. You immaculate wonderful folks like Dr. Scott Hahn, author of, Reasons to Believe, Evangelization Catholics, The Creed, and many more books, Bishop Robert Barron, Word On Fire, Bishop Fulton J Sheen, Fr. Henri Neuwen, the great John Henry Newman, the founder of College Newman Centers around the world. You well know I could go on, space is limited. So you may think why is he saying this? You already know, yes there are millions out there seeking truth, we have a responsibility to share the source of truth. Fight on Christianity warrior, the rewards will be great in heaven. Praise God!

          1. entech

            Well said and admirable, you failed to address the question “how do you know”.
            I am not far behind you in time traveled and like you I do not think of contemplation of death to be morbid.

            I am happy for you that your belief system is giving you joy and peace as you get older, I would disagree on what happens after death – you say heaven or purgatory, there could also be nothing. Like you I think about the unfathomable universe in all its glory, wonder and magnificent beauty. But I don’t need to wait, sitting out on a clear, warm evening and simply contemplating or when the weather is not suitable watching some of the amazing video footage available. One difference between us is that on my death I will decompose into my component atoms and rejoin the universe which gave life to me.
            A magnificent concept of this is from Father George Coyne.
            Life and evolution of the universe and the life in it, he can present a very scientific explanation and do so without giving up his faith. One little thing I get from this, I must add a little tongue in cheek to avoid being labelled TOO arrogant – You claim Jesus died for you, several stars had to die for me 🙂

            A shorter presentation (15m instead of 1hr15m) can be found at “We are all made of stardust | George Coyne | TEDxYYC.”
            Also on the net is a very civilised conversation between Fr,Coyne and the infamous R. Dawkins.

            You end up talking about “we have a responsibility to share the source of truth.” By the same token as one who does not believe in your truth I feel an obligation perhaps even a responsibility to present an alternative possibility.

      2. Catcher

        @ 12;11; re. 2% violators. Actually, if one does the math, with the consideration of these 2 % shifted around, the number of victims and communities increases substantially. Just in the last year, the local paper had pictures on “wanted posters” naming two that had served in 5 congregations. just locally. No information where or what happened before coming here, or after. Let’s then do the math. If they each served (conservatively) 6 parishes / joint parishes, per priest, there is the real probability of at least 12 communities per priest affected and many more children permanently injured. How many children? Let’s say only three per parish during their time in each parish. (There are records of 30 or more by one priest). Assuming then 2 priests x 6 parishes x 3 children= 36 injured children. 2% does not look so small now. It’s not about the priests as much as it is about those permanently injured and them. By shifting that 2% around to greener pastures, the real number of victims will never be known, but 2 % gives a very weak comparison. Thanks to the Bishops that in large part, (as has been reported) knowingly did so. I may also add that Bishops are part of the Magisterium, and the Apostolic “suggestion” AKA succession. Corruption at the highest level. Get out your five buckle overshoes boys.

        1. Catcher

          @ 9;31; So let’s take this “math” one step farther. We have established the probability of 18 child violations per priest @ only 2 % of the priests during the length of their active vocation. Using 18 as a factor, take 2% of the total number of active priests times 18 across the nation. You do the math on that. Again 2% is not such a small number compared to the permanently injured children.
          How many priests are there? Next, go world wide.

          1. Catcher 9:55 A statistic that would be interesting would be to compare the experience of law breaker, child molesters, money thieves, etc. in the Catholic Church and among all other Christian branches. I, myself, do not know what it would show.

            I only know what I have observed in the six yearly publications of the Freedom From Religion Foundation. Some gleans press reports worldwide about clergy encountering law enforcement and/or the court system. That does not mean all bad deeds are reported.

            What I have seen there is that 1.) there are almost no reports of misdeeds by what I would call mainstream Protestant denominations and 2.) almost all reports come from what appear to be freestanding Protestant churches and clergy identified as Catholic. There are more from the freestanding Protestant churches than from the Catholic but, again, almost none from mainline Protestant.

            The entire difference could be simply the large numbers of Catholic and freestanding Protestants and smaller numbers of mainline clergy. I do not know these numbers.

          2. Catcher

            Jon @ 10;32; There are a couple solid reasons you don’t find reports of such abuse. 1. There is no higherarchical structure in place to “push it upstairs”. 2. In our Synod (I have shared this before) When a pastor is called to another congregation, or retires, a list of eligible candidates provided by the synod or brought to the floor by members of that particular church, at a congregational meeting is sent to civil authorities for a criminal and sexual background check. No exceptions. Included in this is an inspection of previous churches served by the candidates. If a sexual infraction OR FELONY is revealed, he is immediately removed from the synodical roster, and the call from his current placement is removed, and no call to the new church is issued. He is OUT ! The calling congregation then votes for a remaining candidate to the call. The congregation is the calling authority. None are appointed by synod. It is the responsibility of each particular church to monitor the known behavior of the pastor. If misbehavior is shown to be true after through investigation, his call is removed by the congregation, and synod removes him from the roster.
            Several years ago, one of our pastors “up North” was discovered to have abused a vulnerable adult female member he was counseling. When she realized what was going on, She came forward, Some members covered for him, and she went to synod. After investigation,The synod removed him from the roster, She sued him and the particular congregation. She won, and wound up with all the church assets, including the church building itself. Not sure of civil ramifications. That congregation then sought financial help to rebuild from all the churches in the district. No help was provided.

          3. Jinx

            Good for her, your Synod takes these issues seriously and does something about it! Do they also contact the police?

          4. Catcher

            Jinx @ 4;26. re. call the police; Yes, That’s the first call on all things a particular congregation, Followed by a call to synod informing them what’s going on.

          5. Catcher

            Jinx @ 4;26; A brief follow up; re. “contact police”. It’s all so very simple. “The separation of church and state”. Anything criminal, ie. sex abuse problems, theft etc. are clearly matters of State, ( police / courts.) Matters dealing with theology or ecclesiology are matters of Church.

          6. Jinx

            The Catholic church didn’t call the police until recently ordered to by the current Pope. The Synod did the right thing right from the start, kudos to them for their decency.

        2. You remind me of Leonard McCoy, i.e. lots of emotion and not much logic. “Jim, I’m a doctor, not a theologian.”

          I’m prone to believe you hate the Catholic Church as much as Jon and the boys, oh, sorry Jinx.

          1. entech

            Matt @ 7:20 and 7:22
            Catcher rarely gets “frustrated in an argument” mainly because he rarely does much more than “Catch” mistakes as he sees them and does what he can to correct those mistakes. I do not think that you are capable of an honest discussion, any logic you posses is subsumed by your dogmatic opinions which you like to describe as immutable and eternal truths.
            Catcher, sorry for butting in but the posts and words are very close.

            I am glad I can supply some amusement, the frustration is inherent in you discussions – you start from a position of there is a God and the Bible is his true word. Then you compound this, in the words of Erwin:
            the Catholic Church was instituted by Jesus Christ when he selected Peter for its first leader.
            Now I respond to this with simple childlike question; “how do you know this”?
            As I said then I do not know any way to demonstrate that this is false or to confirm that it is true only that I do not believe it.
            You say my posts tells you that I am actually quite the hater of the Church. this is simply more of your own hatred and denigration and effectually calling me a liar, all things that are wrong and part of your delusion and reversing everything.
            Any direct quote that shows hatred for your Church ???
            I confess to contempt for you but you, you may be surprised to know, are merely one member and I think not a very good one.

          2. entech

            Matt you do love that word “hate”, the concept seems to consume you, I do think most of it your own reflected out to others.

            Presuming your@ 12:38 was referring to catcher. Catcher and I do not agree on very much but I would like to think that neither of us actually hate the Catholic Church as such, merely think that it is wrong (and this for completely different reasons).

            It is a rather sad reflection on you that you continually mistake disagreement and a refusal to accept your narrow belief system as
            hatred and denigration

          3. Jinx

            I disagree with Catcher on some things but I do find him to be honest and truthful. On the other hand, you and your deceptive Christian Shariah Cult members lack any respect for anything that differs from your narrow world view. You are the one who creates dissent and division and has been banned from certain organizations in the Fargo area, as evidenced by news articles in The Forum.

          4. Catcher goes off the deep end on the Catholic Church whenever he gets frustrated in an argument. He likes to play the shell game with his sect of Lutheranism. I’d prefer a more honest discussion as he can be quite logical, at times.

          5. entech, you both amuse and frustrate. you want to think that you are merely a person who disagrees with the Catholic Church but reading your posts you are actually quite the hater of the Church.

          6. Catcher

            Matt @ 7;20; re. “frustration”, “honest discussion”.
            I’m not frustrated with you at all. That you have not in the main responded to topics at hand, which in turn prevents you from participating in an “honest discussion” is on you, not me.
            You are projecting your own personal frustration. “Sorry Charlie,” that’s not going to work.
            Like with jimmie the priest, an “honest discussion” (your words) with you is virtually impossible. That too is on you, and completely expected.

            I have provided you with several opportunities of “honest discussion”, only to be met with evasion. Also on you.
            In fact, one can question if you even know what “honest”, or “discussion” is.
            It must be “frustrating” for you to speak someone else’s mind, but not your own.

          7. Catcher

            Matt @ 7;20; “Frustrated”? Not in the least. “Honest discussion”? I have provided you with several opportunities for “honest discussion” with no response. You are not capable, nor willing to have “honest discussion”. Similar to james the priest. If it’s not your Dogma, it’s hate. There is the source of your “frustration”. You are projecting your own emotions and blaming everyone else.

            Matt; Several years ago, I had a conversation with a recovering alcoholic. I knew him quite well. He said that whenever he was at a party or social function, he thought everyone else was as drunk as he was. After he sobered up, he discovered he was the only one drunk. Time for you to sober up.

          8. Catcher

            @ 7;20; Matt; “He likes to play the shell game with his sect of Lutheranism. I’d prefer a more honest discussion….”

            Well Matt; Here is your opportunity for “a more honest discussion”.
            The topic is your application of “sect”. What it is, what it isn’t. And;
            What is a shell game, and what it isn’t

            If you are up to it, let’s have a it.

      3. Jinx

        Here is a link that talks about 2 priests.

        Father Thomas Adamson from MN is covered extensively and the number of boys he molested is still unknown (I have seen estimates of over 200). Father James Porter is the second one and he admitted to molesting around 100 kids (again I have seen estimates of over 200 for him as well). Catcher is absolutely correct stating the 1 priest can have numerous victims over the years, thus destroying or seriously affecting numerous lives. I have read and heard in lectures that the numbers of victims that come forward in priest abuse cases is only the tip of the iceberg….conservative estimates are for 1 priest victim who comes forward there are about 15 that don’t. Pedophiles in general often have victims that number into the hundreds.

        A quote from the news article. “Father James Porter, who, unlike Adamson, provided an estimate of the children he molested. Over the span of a 30-year career, Porter admitted to abusing more than 100 boys.”

  2. Jinx

    I never said I hated you or your cult followers, if anything I am indifferent towards you and the others. I don’t give a damn what you do or don’t believe. I do hate what you say to any one who differs from you narrow world view. I am beginning to believe you are nothing but a one trick pony and if the church suddenly reverses it opinion and no longer opposes abortion your are out of there like a gunshot.
    March 19, 2017 at 7:38 pm

    1. JINX, sir, there are many guys taking advantage of this program, including me, they are will able to pay for their own meals. I may be wrong, I suggest, perhaps a second look might reveal they need to cut fat from this program, as with many other entitlement programs In our state of North Dakota we face a similar dilemma, we are experiencing a serious sort fall in revenue. Example, our North Dakota State University is currently facing a significant cut in funding. And that is only one example, numerous other agencies are feeling the same pain. Respectfully submitted!

      1. Juan Ruiz

        “our North Dakota State University is currently facing a significant cut in funding. ”

        I’m not sure who has any empathy for ND higher ed. For 2 decades they went on a spending spree: new president houses, big subsidies for athletics, flat enrollment, low graduation rates after 4 years, bloated administrations, the firing of two chancellors at the behest of presidents who wanted to keep their little fiefdoms.

      2. Jinx

        So you admit taking advantage of Meals on Wheels, why don’t you stop hypocrite?

        Meals on Wheels was an essential program for my in laws, both frail and with dementia and little extra money and has helped (along with Food Stamps) the elderly eat a little better than the cat food they existed on up to the 1960’s. It filled in where we could not on a daily basis.

    2. Matt Noah

      Meals on Wheels will survive without the funding of the feds who only pay 3% of the total. Fake News for which you fell.

      1. Matt, wonderfully said. I’m off to do my hour of perpetual adoration, you and all the visitors to this site will be in my prayers. My prayers for a kinder and gentler attitude as we sojourn home to eternal joy and peace with our heavenly Father. May we draw closer and with common sense during our inter change of ideas, recognizing the diversity in thought is what makes our nation great. I pray to God for decency as I participated in this dialogue. God bless us all!

          1. Friend! My sincere appreciation for your kind words!.Today I had in wonderful experience, as I prayed the Lenten Divine Intimacy, I came upon a paragraph that jumped off the page. Let me share: But Lord, you know my weakens, every morning I make a resolution to practice humility, and every evening I acknowledge that I still have many failures. I am tempted to be discouraged by this, I know that discouragement also has it’s source of pride. This is why we prefer to put our trust in God alone.

            Matt, I started to research the stories about priests handing out contraceptives, do you suppose this is another “pedophile priests” allocation?” Should of one even share a view and dignify this continuing effort o denigrate Catholicism?

          2. Ervin Miller: We both hold up our priests in prayer and reverance but must also correct them if they bring scandal to our Church. I would not infer he had any other sin other than the distribution of ‘birth control’. He might be exemplary in every other regard. Many lay people make the mistake but he should know better. Perhaps his Bishop is working to correct him.

            Jon and others like to point out scandal and this is, indeed, a scandal. It is not, however, a teaching of the Church. Jon works on the uninformed to sway them away from religion. Old tricks from his days at NDSU are still in play.

            It may have been Archbishop Fulton Sheen or another good person that coined the phrase, “The Church is not a museum of saints but more a hospital for sinners.” We are all sinners and this priest’s ailment is on full display. I pray that God forgives my sins and keeps me close to His heart. I also pray for this priest.

            I had 3 uncles who were priests. Most priests, like my uncles, were wonderful priests. The sacrifices these men make to spread the Gospel, administer the sacraments and inspire us is not heralded enough. And Jon, entech and Jinx (and others) will spend their entire commentary on Catholicism relishing in scandal. It certainly is easier to stand tall when you beat down the people around you so you appear taller.

  3. The US government could withdraw from all philanthropic work and be in line with the US Constitution, the Declaration of Independence and the Magna Carta. That means no Social Security, no welfare, no food stamps (BTW, stamps don’t exist anymore), no AFDC, no Medicare, no Medicaid, pretty much nothing.

    Forced charitable giving in the forms described above is not “giving”. It becomes an entitlement and does not touch the heart of the ‘giver’ since the giver has no choice to give. No act of charity occurs. We all become equal ‘givers’ under the law and can be arrested, tried, found guilty and imprisoned for not being charitable.

    As I stated before, Meals on Wheels is supported by the federal government to the tun of 3% of its budget. Here is but reference to my statement – One can also download the program’s annual financial statement to verify what you should not question, i.e my veracity.

    At this point, forget the tiny hit on Meals on Wheels. In reality, it won’t get trimmed $1. The need for meals should be delivered to Yemen. The images of starvation moves me to mention this. Foreign aid? We should be delivering food to Yemen and other places where starvation is present.

    1. unregenerate

      Matt Noah 03.20.2017 at 12:52 pm

      Let us insist that all religious organizations rely solely on philanthropy and stop their entitlement to tax exemptions in excess of 100 billion dollars a year. Of course those that donate could take a 10% income tax credit for their contribution. Your thoughts sir.

      1. unregenerate: I don’t pretend to know how Church funding works around the entire globe. I was baffled that the German government collects “tithes” from its citizens, requires them to identify along religious classifications and then distributes these “tithes” to the churches in Germany! That is not philanthropy. It is, obviously, quite different in the USA.

        If a church owns property and leases it out to private interests while its future may be a school or church, is that a misuse? It certainly is not money derived from philanthropy.

        I don’t have a concrete opinion on your hypothesis. I have no idea how you arrived at the figure of $100B.

        Right now, charitable contributions are deductions to income in the USA, not a deduction on taxes. That would be quite an incentive to divert money from going to the IRS, to one’s Church. If that were allowed, many groups would rush to become ‘churches’!

      1. unregenerate

        Mr. Miller @ 1:54 pm

        If I may share a thought you might appreciate: No matter how far I wonder from the Lord, when I turn back I’m already half way home.

        1. Unregenerate,I will not engage in a dialogue about your views, your are free to choose, as I am free to choose. For too long I engaged in pride and so as I reach closure in this brief earthly journey, I’m reflecting on my performance within the sphere of those I associated with. And as I examine my conscience I recall fascia behaviour, scorn, contempt, belittling, lies, denigration, unscrupulous, condensing and more. As the clock runs down, I’m praying for atonement of my sins. I frequently attend Mass, pray the rosary, often with Mother Angelic on Catholic EWTN, study the bible, and contemplate on period just before and after my death, praying for God’s mercy!

          1. entech

            Ervin, I do think we are going through a little bit of false humbleness here. from the way you write you still have many of those failings you have just added extreme sanctimony to compensate for your fear of death.

          2. unregenerate

            Mr. Miller @ 3:42 pm

            I was hoping for a moment of civility. Your loss sir. Even an infidel can have insights into matters of the spirit. You and your ilk haven’t cornered the market.

            By the way, the words ‘I pray for you’ or ‘God bless you’ coming from the mouth of a self-righteous christian ‘warrior’ is an insult. Do you pretend a legitimate proxy for your god and what makes your petitions so special anyway? It’s sure flavorful though, is it not? That sweet morsel of momentary power. One wonders, does a pretense of humility mask some genuine contempt here? After all, Christianity has been aptly named the religion of resentment. Well then, god bless you too Ervin.

          3. entech: Why don’t you show some friendship and understanding and leave Ervin alone. Since he is a devout Catholic, I understand that you HAVE to show scorn. But isn’t that the problem, you can’t give him the benefit of the doubt as to his disposition. I find Ervin transparent and refreshing, and not just because he is a fellow Catholic.

          4. entech

            Matt, I gave ErvIn the benefit of the doubt for quite a while but as he has drawn himself closer to you I have put him in the same “cabal”.

            One does not HAVE to show scorn, really a dialogues would be better but your behavior always becomes scornful.

    2. Jinx

      That is NOT what your Jesus preached, we are to care for others in all ways and there is no way around those words. Why don’t you take erv the nerve to task for accepting the fruits of a program he says he is taking advantage of? The least he could do is the meals to a poor family or single Mom down the street. worm and erv the nerve are not following Jesus instructions, there heart id hard, cold and black as the void they live in.

      1. Jinx – the expert on Catholicism. Are we now to believe you taught in the seminary? And “erv the nerve” and “worm” probably don’t think too much about your petty insults and demeaning ways. “… hard, cold and black as the void they live in.” Such loving words. May God bless you and give you peace!

        1. Jinx

          Assume what you wish but don’t put words in my mouth, a practice you commonly do. It doesn’t take any type of training to understand the simple words of your Jesus when he says to care and take care of others, you will find it in Matthew. Hypocrite.

          1. I just quote you!!! That is putting words in your mouth only because that is where they came from. You must be in some asylum somewhere. Drugs? Mental illness? What is it?

  4. Godless

    This is a little off the current topic but i feel it is worth mentioning. Atheists are accused of of recruiting people to our way of thinking from articles like this one. I know Jon has been accused of this.

    When you look at each succeeding generation in the United States you see a clear trend forming. People are becoming less religious, godless if you will. Many reasons for this, not going to get into those though. One i would like to address is pride, one of the seven deadly sins

    People like Matt are driving more young people to atheism far more efficiently than Jon ever could. Pride will not allow people like him to admit when they are wrong. Pride will not let you admit that the child abuse in the catholic church is a serious problem. A problem that is contributing to the demise of the catholic church.

    When you look at the last five generations you see a trend forming. The rate of individuals associating with a religion is significantly dropping. Generation Y surveyed and found that 41 percent listed religion as something really important. What should scare the shit out of people like Matt is that a lot of those people view god very differently. In 30 years or so we will see percentages of god fearing individuals like we currently see in Sweden, Norway, Finland and many other countries.

    So my point is keep up the good work Matt, keep up the crusading. If i were you i would ratchet up the pious arrogance that you so effectively use.

    1. entech

      I must confess I had to look it up, not part of my vocabulary at all. One definition for oldies had the phrase;
      Although it may be tempting, don’t try using “Swag” after reading this guide. You old people have killed swag just by knowing about it. Sorry, but that’s how these things work.


  5. Catcher

    I do wish some people here would indicate to whom they are talking to at the top of their post. Indents are not the most reliable indicators, but a neat way to hide. This would greatly reduce confusion. Pay attention Matt ! ! You have been informed about this before, and as usual, you only talk, and never listen.- – – -” Can you hear me now?”

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